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Sycamore and the Marines
http://dirttreaders.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=16151		 Page 4 of 6
Author:  65mph12 [ Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
I was heading back to parking ~9:30 yesterday. I saw a couple of groups heading in, but no marines. I did see some marker sticks though. I wonder if building is going to start soon.
Author:  racerbill [ Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
My brother-in-law just called me from the West Hills dirt parking lot and there are five guys standing there with tickets from the Marines they got after just after passing the signs near the powerlines
Author:  65mph12 [ Mon Jan 04, 2016 1:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
racerbill wrote:
My brother-in-law just called me from the West Hills dirt parking lot and there are five guys standing there with tickets from the Marines they got after just after passing the signs near the powerlines

But no confiscations as reported a couple posts up?

It seems the word "confiscated" is thrown around in these threads from time to time, but I have yet to hear anyone report that their bike was actually taken.
Author:  racerbill [ Mon Jan 04, 2016 1:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
No confiscations this time and they told my brother-in-law the tickets were only $25 but I'm sure this will ramp up over time .
Author:  racerbill [ Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
Just talked to the Marines myself south of the Golder Ranch by their signs they said they had given out 30 tickets down by the lake and confiscated six bikes told me not to ride on their land anymore . Anybody know if the Eastside of Sycamore Canyon is OK legally
Author:  evdog [ Sat Jan 16, 2016 8:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
Sycamore Canyon proper is entirely on Marine land. The only part that isn't is where the Ridge trail drops down but you have to go north to the Sycamore Goodan gate to stay legal. There isn't a legal connection right now between Sycamore and Fanita. Not that Fanita itself is legal either. Like a lot of our riding areas we could lose access to it if the landowner decides to crack down, if they ever build on it, if it is bought for preservation.
Author:  bajamtnbkr [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 12:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
My friend and his riding group(about 8) got their bikes confiscated today. He saids he saw about 20 bikes being taken by the marines. This happen by the Powerlines going on their way back to Mast Blvd. :(
Author:  racerbill [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 9:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
Found this online check out the map page 14
http://www.miramar-ems.marines.mil/Port ... %20Use.pdf
The light blue patches on the right side of the map are what we're talking about. It should be no problem the Marines to allow use of that.
Author:  65mph12 [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 9:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
racerbill wrote:
Just talked to the Marines myself south of the Golder Ranch by their signs they said they had given out 30 tickets down by the lake and confiscated six bikes told me not to ride on their land anymore . Anybody know if the Eastside of Sycamore Canyon is OK legally


What kind of vehicles did they have? With all this talk of confiscation, I wonder how they move the bikes out of the area. Are they bringing trucks down from the ridges? I've only seen atv tracks so far.

Also, were they in plain sight as you approached?

If by "east side" you mean the Mel Brooks trails, and hidden trail to the north, they are not MCAS. Not sure about legalities.
Author:  65mph12 [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 9:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
racerbill wrote:
Found this online check out the map page 14
http://www.miramar-ems.marines.mil/Port ... %20Use.pdf
The light blue patches on the right side of the map are what we're talking about. It should be no problem the Marines to allow use of that.

That would be great. The county has been trying to negotiate this. It's hopeful to see it on a Marine land use document.
Author:  Squid [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 5:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
Got this from a friend today. I guess his buddies were told that they would have to go to court to get the bike back.

Attachments:
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Author:  Ray Dolor [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 8:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
racerbill wrote:
Found this online check out the map page 14
http://www.miramar-ems.marines.mil/Port ... %20Use.pdf
The light blue patches on the right side of the map are what we're talking about. It should be no problem the Marines to allow use of that.


Reasonably, probably not, but we are talking about Marines, here. I Have seldom seen reason as a primary concern from the Marines.
Author:  racerbill [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 8:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
Advocacy, send your congressman and county supervisor a message and let them know what's going on. The SDMBA needs to step up here and show some leadership
Author:  Dirtrider [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
racerbill wrote:
Advocacy, send your congressman and county supervisor a message and let them know what's going on. The SDMBA needs to step up here and show some leadership


Man, I just have to discuss this a bit further...

Advocacy- Have you (not just you racerbill but all who have this same question) stepped into SDMBA monthly advocacy meetings that are open to all? Have you showed up to any of the meetings for missing trails? If you don't have the time or the want that's cool, the part about contacting elected officials would be helpful for someone to do. Whatever anyone can do is better than bitching about it and seeing the same old BS happen and wondering why.

SDMBA- I've been wanting to chime in on this for a couple of weeks now and didn't really how how to say it but I'll try it now. What is SDMBA? Is it like the government or the city? Some big agency that you pay with every paycheck and don't get crap for your hard earned dollars? Not even close my friend.
It people, people that ride just like us, that give whatever time they can, for no money, taking crap from everyone that has ever seen a closed trail sign. There efforts are mostly unseen, sitting in boring as crap city meetings that they left work early for, hoping for two minutes of talk time if that.
In years past most weren't too happy with SDMBA and they all think they have valid reasons. Maybe so, maybe not if they knew everything behind the scenes. The board has changed and I for one think it's for the better. Is MTRP still a mess? Sure is but people continuing to do things that they know are wrong aren't helping whatever effort SDMBA is doing or anyone else effort either.
SDMBA is Ben going to all those boring meetings, it's Rod sitting on local CAC meeting for 6 years to finally get a trails plan to open trails on Blk Mt. You know the one that everyone has been building every weekend with the support of the rangers. It's Matt that gets up early to load his truck full of tools and drinks so he can support the trails building crews. It's Rich that goes out on his own to fix a trail that been blown out. It's all the people that have stepped into a thankless position to be a liaison for certain areas around San Diego. SDMBA are people like you and others that choose to take whatever time they can spare to try and make a difference.
Reachout to SDMBA and see what they are up to at MTRP. Get the truth and see how hard it's been to move things forward. See if you have an hour a week to help.
Do something if possible but please don't bash people that are trying much more than you know to make MTRP and other areas better.

We do have a bit more of legal trails at DMM. Yea, I know all the BS there and we don't need to debate it any further. Opening a couple of closed ones are better than nothing to me. Building some great trail up on Blk Mt has been fantastic and that area might end up being some of the best riding we have in the area.

I'm not a SDMBA board member but I have my membership active. Heck, just doing that will save you money at many bike shops around town and save you much more than the $30 it costs you. I've gone to meeting as the fat old fart in the back of the room to hear things for myself and not have to relay on internet misinformation. I try to help out on some of the build days. Can't make them all but I feel some is better than none.

All I'm trying to say is SDMBA are people trying their best. Some of them have seen more results than others and some have sore heads from banging it against the wall. Help the problem if you can..
(stepping off soap box now and ready for a flaming if you feel so inclined.)

Ride on :cheers: :hello:
Author:  GForce [ Sun Jan 17, 2016 10:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Sycamore and the Marines
racerbill wrote:
Found this online check out the map page 14
http://www.miramar-ems.marines.mil/Port ... %20Use.pdf
The light blue patches on the right side of the map are what we're talking about. It should be no problem the Marines to allow use of that.


County Supervisor Jacob has been for years trying to get that corridor opened and has gone so far as to travel to Washington DC to meet with top Marine brass and other officials. Somewhere in 2006 or 2007, then Senator Hillary Clinton declared the Stowe Trail "a national historic trail". There is (used to be?) a plaque down near that gate heading back down to Santee lakes. Besides the reference racerbill posted above, the Congressional record (see http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/R?r ... 001:S08938) states, "Mrs. FEINSTEIN. Mr. President, I rise today in support of an amendment to the fiscal year 06 National Defense Authorization Act, S. 1042, that authorizes the Navy to convey approximately 230 acres of open space land along the eastern boundary of Marine Corps Air Station Miramar to the county of San Diego in order to provide access to the historic Stowe Trail.

The Stowe Trail at one time functioned as the primary road leading to the historic town of Stowe, and now links the Goodan Ranch and Sycamore Canyon Preserves in the north with the Mission Trails Regional Park and Santee Lakes Regional Recreation Area further south.

According to county records, up until the 1930s when access to this portion became restricted for military use, the Stowe Trail had served for some 80 years as the principle thoroughfare between the towns of Santee and Poway.

The 230 acres of land that would be conveyed by the Navy under this provision include diverse plant and animal life and environmentally-sensitive habitats and would provide a natural wildlife corridor between the two preserves, as well as with the Santee Lakes Recreation Area.

Under the control of the County of San Diego, this land will become part of an extensive open space trail system that will not only increase recreational opportunities in the region, but will also provide a buffer zone that will mitigate against potential encroachment that could impact the essential military missions at Marine Corps Air Station Miramar.

It is important to point out that this proposed land conveyance is the fruition of a process set in motion jointly by the San Diego County Board of Supervisors and Marine Corps Air Station Miramar in 2002.

Both sides have worked together closely since that time to ensure that the result will be a win-win situation for both county and the Marines.

For example, as part of the land conveyance process, the County of San Diego has fully committed to compensate the Navy by paying the full fair market value for this property.

I would therefore ask unanimous consent that it be in order for the Senate to consider this amendment, and that the amendment be agreed to.

I would also ask that this statement and the relevant amendment be placed together in the CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. "

The caveat is that line about paying the Navy "full market value for this property" that has been the sticking point. Maybe it's time to lobby some Congressional representatives or Senators?
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