While interesting, this is a disappoinment. This whole thing is a huge disappointment. I believe the reason Hincapie and these guys are "singing" now is because they've been called before a grand jury. Once they raise their hand and swear to tell the truth in a court of law, all of a sudden it gets a bit scary.

While I watch with great interest as this thing unravels, I wish there were nothing for these guys to tell. Oh well.

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"New York City is a mismanaged carnival of stupidity that is desperate for revenue and anxious to criminalize behavior once thought benign."
--Alex Baldwin, unknowingly describing his socialist utopia.

the french press was always on the bandwagon of armstrong doping.

.....freedom fries anyone?


as kev m said, i think it's a game of what the tests specifically recognize, then covering for that or using an analog that is not (yet) detectable. if your team has the funding to keep a couple of steps ahead, you're cool.

i don't know if armstrong ever said he's never taken any enhancing drugs, what he does say is that after x # of tests, all were negative.

i liked what armstrong did for the sport, but mostly that no matter how big he got he never, ever forgot about his experiences and the hell his fellow cancer patients live through and die by. his story is inspiring, his motivation is inspiring and contagious. everyone doped just to compete.


mr prosecuting attorney, leave him alone. you want to bag bad guys, get some f'n balls and go after these greedy asshats and do the world a service:
Goldman Sachs CEO Lloyd Blankfein

get this guy in a real prison where be becomes someones play toy and we just might turn the corner on limits of greed wall street is willing to risk.

the world will thank you.


bag armstrong and you're just another celebrity chasing dirtbag that the world outside of the nat'l enquirer can well do without.


just my $0.02 as a charter member of the STFU club.

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Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy. ~Milan Kundera

That's what they did. Landis confessed, and explained how riders control their biological passport values to beat tests. Hamilton confessed about his own drug use for the investigation, and returned his Olympic Gold Medal for the Time Trial.

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There's a lot of shame on a road bike. -- evdog

He says, "I have never tested positive."

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There's a lot of shame on a road bike. -- evdog

I respectfully disagree with that comment, it sure does.

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"In a time of universal deciet, telling the truth is a revolutionary act" - George Orwell

I'm curious what everyone's take is on one thing: Tyler Hamilton basically said everyone was doing it. Frankie Andreau said that guys who were doping were radically faster than those that weren't.

We know Ulrich, Basso and scores of other main competitors doped. So did Lance have a radically unfair advantage when he was "just" beating other dopers? With so many of his competitors doping, if you found out for certain he doped, would it diminish the feat that is 7 straight Tour victories?

Just food for thought and I'd like to hear other people's opinions. I'm not a Lance fan. I used to think he was clean. Now I think the evidence to the contrary is pretty overwhelming.

BTW doping is also theft of millions of dollars from the would be winner. There is no way we should be cool with anything just because everyone is doing it. Didn't we learn that in Kindergarten? I am dissapointed to see so much support for this shameful act....And wo cares how much he raised for cancer. I gave to the red cross alot last year. Should that get me out of my speeding ticket?

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"In a time of universal deciet, telling the truth is a revolutionary act" - George Orwell

In answer to Doug's question, and without getting into a long polemic about it, I have to say "yes." Assuming for the sake of this post that Lance did dope (and I believe he did), all we know about him for certain is that he was the fastest cheater in the field.

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A bicycle is a splendid thing.
~Ernest Hemingway

Neither one just work up and proclaimed to the world that they did drugs. Only after they were caught and fought to prove their innocents, only to lose that battle did they start singing.

I'm a believer that just because my parade got rained on doesn't mean I should rain on everyone else's.

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A mountain biker who doesn't ride road has no legs
A road biker who doesn't ride mountain has no soul

Let's be clear on what the Feds are investigating Armstrong for. The Feds aren't going after him just for doping -- taking performance enhancers or injecting EPO in and of itself is not a crime. Nor is this a perjury investigation a la Barry Bonds or Roger Clemens - I don't think Armstrong has ever sworn under oath that he never doped.

The Feds are most likely going to charge Armstrong with a fraud/misuse of public funds type of crime, or maybe even a RICO charge. Remember, he was a member of the US Postal team -- a taxpayer-sponsored team. The core question is whether Lance, his teammates, coaches and support team systematically used/diverted public funds to sponsor their doping programs.

i do.

if getting a speeding ticket collapses your multi million dollar benefit organization for a life threatening disease, then yes.

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Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy. ~Milan Kundera

Pardon me but that is a load of bollocks! The Mafia gives back to communities. Lloyd Blankfein had charities set up...all so that when they get caught they can say, I am a man of the people. I give more than I've taken.

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"In a time of universal deciet, telling the truth is a revolutionary act" - George Orwell

You know, it's possible to commend him for what he's done to raise money for cancer research and inspire hope among cancer patients while at the same time criticizing him for being a pompous, self-righteous, and egotistical cheater.

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A bicycle is a splendid thing.
~Ernest Hemingway

as per your statement above, i think you may be using a stringent interpretation, black or white, without portraying the gravity of what's in the balance.

blankfein played no small role in sending the world into a recession tailspin at the cost of millions of jobs and families livelihoods, national debt, and putting a few nations in economic collapse. the global hardship was immense. even those seemingly unaffected are having social security and medicare on the table for cuts due to the debt created. the mafia isn't even in the same league. this is not a speeding ticket analogy.

but my point was more that i don't think it worth the time and expense of prosecution so some media whore can write a book on how he brought armstrong down. but importantly i don't believe it will change how quickly the authorities will be able to detect newer drugs or, by extension, markedly change the course of 'enhancement approaches' in sports. if the latter were true, that the authorities would garner more money for better more rigorous testing and clean up all sports, then yeah, i'm for it. but that's not what this media circus is about. blankfein is another story. i do feel that jail time for him and his cronies will change the course of how business is conducted.

although i liked what armstrong did for the sport, particularly for u.s. interest which was nearly non-existant prior, even with le mond some years before, i remember him as being a rather objectionable person before his ordeal. i personally don't care whether he gets prosecuted for this or not. however, medical research has been badly hit from the economic downturn. any money that can be used to help people from suffering and dying from disease is needed now more than ever from outside resources. although i don't care what happens to armstrong the man, if it turns out he used illegal enhancement drugs his charity will undoubtably suffer, and i do care about people suffering and dying from disease.

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Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy. ~Milan Kundera